The Democratic Primaries? STILL not over. I think it’s funny how upset everyone is that Hillary won’t drop out. She has money, she has a campaign team, she’s winning states, why shouldn’t she run all the way to the convention? Isn’t that the point of the convention, to select the general election nominee? I mean, nobody is upset that Ron Paul is still running on the GOP side …
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I actually have grown to admire Hillary a bit for her tenacity, although she still reminds us of Nixon, ready to do anything to win.
Feh. I’m not voting for her or Obama.
Wow, I didn’t realize the “Bush 3rd Term” movement had reached so far north! Congrats on your progressivism. Death to the 22nd Amendment!
[shifty eyes - wondering if Chad's being cute or really just coming AFTER me]
Hey, I’m going to find someone - anyone - who I actually think has the American peoples’ best interests at heart and vote for them. No more playing the numbers for me. No more taking the lesser of two evils.
I’m pretty sure this blog doesn’t want to hear my ideas of how Bush is going to hold on after January. Let’s just say that the Lone Gunmen are three of my favorite people in the entertainment pantheon.
(cute)
Ah. Good. Gracias. Sorry.
Didn’t Aly write a blog a long time back about “on this blog, we shall always assume that the best intentions were behind that which another says” or something like that?
Yes - yes she did. I forgot. Apologies.
Cerise -
I heard a pretty smart (albeit… ahem… eccentric) guy lay out his ideas for how something was going to go haywire with Iran conveniently in time for the suspension of the 22nd amendment so Bush could just go on and on and on.
The good news is that I think even hard-line republicans would start to raise an eyebrow over that happening. Also, having seen the video of our president’s appearance on “Deal or No Deal,” something tells me he’s had just about enough of being everyone’s punching bag. As much as I have disdain for some of his policies, I sorta feel bad for the guy. I betcha he has one of those “Countdown to the end of the Bush presidency” clocks on his desk in the oval office. That’d be hilarious.
Funny… digressing to the other discussion about the Marines, we took an extended tour of the base with the Chaplain who was our host, and during that time he gave a really compelling talk about what it’s like to counsel young Christian men who have just followed orders and taken another human life in the course of war.
Now, what follows is his thinking, not mine, just to be clear, ok?
He said that he tells his young men that as long as they’re following orders, the Scripture teaches that they will not be held accountable for their actions, that it will be their superiors who are judged as to the justice or non-justice of the killings. He said that the reason we should pray for President Bush is that, as Commander-in-Chief, the accountability for all of the lives taken during his presidency will be on him.
I have been wondering if Bush thinks like that. I wonder if he sincerely prays to God, if he understands the old and new covenants, and if so, is that a torturous burden to bear? Thinking about my kids, I am starting to appreciate the idea of “Getting done what must be done.” Responsibility is not something you choose, it chooses you, and you choose to bear it or ignore it.
I’m not defending Bush here, I swear. I think he had a burr up his butt to go to Baghdad, and we’ve all been dragged into it. However, sometimes I wonder if the manner in which we criticize him or discuss him minimizes not only the humanity that has suffered because of the Iraq war, but also minimizes the seriousness of the decisions that God has asked him to make. If God is truly our judge, Bush is gonna have an interesting time, and I would not have wanted to trade places with him at any step along the way.
Not just raised eyebrows - if he’s not out of the building by 12:01 pm on January 20th, I’ll be standing as part of the angry mob of armed conservatives who forcibly removes him.
And it’ll have to be conservatives who do it, because, ya know, we’re the only ones with guns!
Michael, I’ll be right behind you with my torch and pitchfork.
Chad, several statements Bush has made over the years have made me wonder if he feels the burden of responsibility in the way we might hope. I remember listening to a live news conference awhile back — I think it was on the fourth anniversary of the Iraq invasion. I can’t remember the exact phrasing of the question, but the reporter basically asked him if the fact that over 3,500 (at that point) American troops had been killed in post-combat operations kept him up at night. He hemmed and hawed about how great and honorable and brave our troops are and then said, “I sleep great.” Wrong answer, dude. Even if you believe down to your nougetty center that you’re on the side of truth, justice and beautiful free markets, you do not sleep great when 3,500 people have died trying to accomplish your mission. You better effing agonize.
On topic: Ash and I are still secretly hoping that the Dems’ solution is an eleventh-hour call to Al Gore (with Obama as his running mate, of course). That’s starting to look like the only remotely happy ending at this point.
Aly -
Totally… I guess.. Hm. I guess I just can’t swallow the, “He’s just a moron with no conscience” explanation. I have to believe there’s something more to it then that.
Maybe it’s a fool’s hope…
Oh, BTW…
I’m not insinuating that the moron explanation is what you’re saying. I don’t think you’ve been knee-jerk about Bush, at least in my memory. I actually remember a really interesting conversation I had with the 2 of you about him circa the ‘04 election.
Where’s Ronnie when you need him? Or heck… I’d take Bill back at this point.
Safe to say from reports of people “on the inside” that Bush feels the death of every soldier. But if he SAID that in the terms some might like, the lefty press would be all over it with things like, “Even HE admits it’s wrong,” and such. Presidents have to show confidence in war, even an “if you break it, you buy it” war.
The maddening thing for any politician is that you almost never dare actually say what you think or feel.
I’m hoping stll to be alive in 20 years. If any of you are still in my orbit, I’d love to have a talk with you THEN about the last 8. I wonder if we’ll find that what the Bushies were worst at was not policy, but public relations.
What’s funny is this: I’ll bet every one of us has some serious beefs with Bush, but just *different* ones. I think that’s part of what’s behind the very low “do you approve” poll numbers. Lot’s of us disapprove of this or that, but it’s a mistake to lump all the disapprovers into the same category….
Phil -
I think you’re spot on. It’s strange that this particular guy manages to upset so many, and for such a variety of reasons.
Oh… and if bush tries to stay 10 minutes later than the scheduled inauguration of the new pres, I’ll be standing right behind Mike, with a few friends.
But I don’t think he WANTS to.
No, I think he’s lookin’ beat down these days. I imagine him on inauguration day, walking in jeans and boots out the front door with a rolling suitcase, whistling and dropping the keys into Obama’s/Hillary’s/McCain’s hands.
Eeeh eh, later suckas! Dubya out!
This liberal will go BUY a gun and join the conservatives beating down the doors of the white house if Bush stays a microsecond beyond his limit. Time’s almost up, and I for one plan to consume a bottle of champagne with my friends when it is finally over.
Phil, I seriously doubt that we will, 20 years later, be considering Mr. Bush’s policy decisions more positively than we do today. He saw compromise as weakness and, as a result, has made us weaker.
I’ll try to stick around that long for you, though. I’ll only be 70, God willing.
Phil, I too agree with you and have said on many occasions that Bush is acting the part of Commander in Chief and is putting on a brave face so as not to show weakness or waiver in his support of the troops or decisions he has made. I think being a little more vulnerable and authentic would help his poll numbers. He thinks it will make him look weak and indecisive. Like the rest of you, I think he has stumbled and has not had the best advice and Lord knows he is clunky, awkward, uneasy…not easy to watch or listen to. But just because he is not always easy on the eyes or ears, doesn’t make his decision-making wrong. I’m with Phil…time will tell.
A new book is out:
War and Decision by Douglas J. Feith
Everyone on the inside says that Bush and co simply gave up trying to communicate what was going on to the public years back, because they couldn’t get it through major media spin machine.
I do know that I’m aware of things that appear to be well documented that just don’t make it to the evening news or the major papers/news mags.
Now, here’s something to make you think: Christopher Hitchens, the major atheist-booster, is also a big fan of the Iraq war, and thinks it hasn’t been fought vigorously enough, if anything. You should read his work on Saddam and WMD, including nuclear…..
This book looks interesting. It’s the first I know of by a true insider, and it’s copiously backed up with documentation.
It’ll be the first of many. Let the historians sort it out.
Phil,
I have said repeatedly, and will continue to say, that I refuse to believe the oversimplified, bite-sized, SNL approved version of the George W. Bush story.
However, I just have one thought I want to contribute. I believe it’s the President’s responsibility (or any leader, for that matter) to be able to successfully negotiate whatever spin machine is in place. That’s leadership. Leadership doesn’t quit, or throw up their hands in frustration and take their marbles and go home. Leadership, true leadership, finds a way to communicate the superiority of their ideas, in the face of impossible odds.
That’s leadership, IMO.
you folks must know that the view from the rest of the world is very much against what has been happening because of US policies in the last 8 years. It’s not just a view from the left. It’s a view from what is reality for much of the planet. It isn’t a desire for a democrat in the whitehouse, it’s a desire for someone with ears instead of guns.
I personally can’t wait until that big political etchasketch gets a-shook this fall. I’ll be cheering on Obama. Not because he is the promised one, but along with the billions we will hope for something new.
please, please, don’t get caught up in your in-house political squabbles.. the world is at the mercy of american policy decisions.
David, I’m not quite sure how to respond to that, but I will say that it comes across as very condescending. Are you intending to portray the rest of the world as mature, rational adults and the US as squabbling children?
I just can’t accept that assessment. I’ve been to the rest of the world; there’s no special wisdom that comes from being outside the borders of the US.
sorry for sounding like a punk there.
what i mean is not to say that the rest of the world gets it and americans don’t, but that if ever there was an election that should be decided based on foreign policy before domestic policy this is it. I honestly believe that this election may determine the fate of millions on several continents. i don’t mean to suggest that the readers of this blog in particular are making poor choices. not at all. it was a general exacerbation with seemingly continual focus on who is who’s pastor and who thinks who is elitist, and who can’t remember details of a tarmac landing well enough.
so, ya. sorry for acting like an ‘elitist’ myself. i don’t mean to say that i have better knowledge. i just wanted to remind that America is the world’s standing empire and the implications reach countless people who have no vote in this process. we are at the mercy of the American public and their superdelegates.
and i’m quite thankful for the wisdom shown in places like this.
David -
Props for coming back and following up. I, personally, appreciate that. You sound like a reasonable fellow, and, in principle, I think you’ll find that most of the people here agree (to some degree) with what you said about the Bush administration, and a few who will not.
The cool thing about this blog, is that it’s not really a political blog, or a music blog, or a geek blog, or a Christian blog…. it’s about the whatevers on our collective minds.
I remember sitting in a hotel bar in Interlaken, Switzerland with my wife and a bartender, watching the 2002 olympic games, a scant 4-5 months after 9/11. He was passionate about curling, and I had never seen it before in my life. Nothing like a couple of beers and a foreign locale to get a conversation going, and it was a slow night, snowing. The three of us sat there for the better part of two hours, talking about curling, 9/11, Americans in general, etc etc etc.
It was nothing earthshattering, but for me, an American in Europe for the first time, it made me realize that a lot of people around the world spend a fair amount of time thinking about and worrying about America. I know that I, for one, don’t spend a lot of time thinking about Swiss politics.
This is not a good or bad thing, just a thing. I’m not sure why Americans are (here comes a BIG stereotype) generally less interested in the impacts of our policies on the rest of the world then we should be.
Anywhoo…. welcome to the Roadhouse.
Hey, OT… I thought of Phil two nights ago, when Doug Feith was on The Daliy Show. THAT was weird.
Nah nah nah nah, nah nah nah nah, hey hey hey ….